Joe Rogan, Rep James Talarico and A Master Class in Civility

A Rare Dialogue in Divided Times

Recently, I listened to a conversation that felt like a snapshot of our divisive politics – but with a hopeful twist. Two people with seemingly very different viewpoints sat down to discuss the toughest issues facing our country. No soundbites, no shouting match, just an honest conversation. Say what you will about Joe Rogan, but his ability to reach tens of millions makes moments like this conversation uniquely powerful.

In today’s political climate, truly a disorderly journey into the upside down, seeing this kind of civil dialogue was refreshing. It reminded me that even in an era dominated by polarization, it is possible for us to talk with each other instead of at each other. I'm hopeful that, at some point, the political apparatus will drive us all so far around the bend that we meet each other on the other side.

In a recent conversation between Texas State Representative James Talarico (keep an eye on this committed public servant) and conservative influencer Joe Rogan, I saw civility cut through the noise. And it highlighted something profound: when we engage respectfully, we expose the truth and even reveal the hypocrisy lurking in our political theater.

As Talarico said, "I think of politics now less as left versus right and much more as top versus bottom... I just see how we are all pitted against each other."

Both participants in this discussion candidly addressed issues that typically divide us – from faith in politics to abortion – yet they did so without demonizing each other. They challenged ideas instead of questioning motives, and they listened as much as they spoke. This civility, this curiosity, this generosity, is rarely, if ever, exhibited by our political leaders today.

When Civility Cuts Through the Noise

In an age of tribal outrage, basic civility is sometimes dismissed as weakness – but nothing could be further from the truth. Civility is foundational to a functioning democracy. It creates the space for ideas to be heard and for trust to be built.

Talarico reflected on an experience with a gun rights voter that highlighted the importance of face-to-face engagement: "When we were face to face, human to human, suddenly we heard each other. We listened to each other and he realized I was not trying to take people's guns. I have no interest in that. He recognized that I was just trying to find a way to safety, which is his value, too. Suddenly, that's a conversation."

That’s the kind of leadership our times require—not posturing or pandering, but deep listening and mutual respect. It reminded me of something I wrote in a past July 4th piece: "Freedom was never meant as a freedom from civility, society, or reality." Civility isn’t a sign of compromise; it’s the foundation for progress in our collected pursuit of Happiness.

In the Pursuit of Happiness

Authentic Leadership vs. Performative Politics

Too often, as I wrote a few years back our politics has become a stage where a “small group of performance artists [are] orating to an electoral base, not governing for the people.” In this interview, both Rogan and Talarico touched on the emptiness of inauthentic political theater.

Rogan observed: "Authenticity is the thing that's missing from television news. It's missing from anything that's corporate controlled..." And Talarico echoed that when he described how, in the legislature, "you just get rewarded for more and more extreme rhetoric and not for the quiet, behind-the-scenes coalition building that makes government work."

In today's culture, people can sense when a leader is posing. And they can sense when a leader is present. Authenticity is magnetic, and both men modeled it. That’s the kind of leadership we need—leaders who are consistent, honest, and human, leaders who have a strong perspective but strive for the truth of a matter.

“People Will Be What They Can See”: The Power of Role Models

You've all heard me say, “People will be what they can see.” If we keep electing leaders who scream the loudest but solve the least, we shouldn’t be surprised when the extremist cycle continues and cynicism grows. But when people see examples of respect, decency, and determination, it gives them something to follow.

Rogan captured this beautifully when he said: "The only way for [people] to get that [focus and discipline] is to see an example of someone who's doing it. And this is sports... you can learn like what is LeBron James doing that's different?"

And when it comes to teaching or sharing values, Talarico said it best: "We should be leading by example, not by mandate."

That’s why mentorship, role modeling, and leadership-by-example matter so much. It’s not enough to say what we believe. We have to show it in how we treat people.

Faith and Public Life: Living, Not Legislating, Belief

Faith was another powerful undercurrent of their discussion. Talarico, who is both a legislator and a seminary student, spoke eloquently about the danger of fusing Christianity with nationalism:

"Christian nationalism is the worship of power—whether it’s social power, economic power, political power—in the name of Christ."

And he defended religious freedom by reminding us of its origins:

"The staunchest defenders for the separation of church and state throughout American history were Protestant Christians, Baptists in particular... these Protestants were fleeing Europe as religious minorities. This is kind of essential to the founding of this country was religious freedom."

In a time when too many try to use religion as a political bludgeon, Talarico reminds us that faith should inspire personal conduct, not government control. As he put it: "If we have to force people to put up a poster [of the 10 Commandments]... that means we have a dead religion."

Rediscovering Common Ground

Perhaps the most heartening takeaway was how both of them found shared values beneath their surface differences. They want people to live safely. They want honest leaders. They want purpose and dignity in their lives.

Rogan captured that search for meaning when he said: "Every human being needs the desire to work, to produce, to contribute. I think that is a natural human urge that's built into us."

Talarico connected that to public service: "I saw firsthand how [policy decisions] screwed up a kid's life... I promised myself right then that if I ever got a little bit of power... I would do everything I could... to stop that from happening again."

And on unity, Talarico offered perhaps the most powerful reminder:

"If we recognize that we have far more in common than the stuff that divides us, then that's a threat to [entrenched power]... That unity, loving your enemy... is good strategic advice."

That’s what I mean when I say that we must stop letting the loudest voices drown out the wisest ones. It’s not about agreeing on every issue. It’s about agreeing that we’re in this together.

The Path Forward: Choose to Build

If this conversation showed us anything, it’s that the exhausted majority is still out there. Most Americans aren’t extreme. They just want to be heard, respected, and inspired. They want leaders who build, not blow things up. I’ve written before about Daniel Lubetzsky of the Builders Movement: "Extremists don’t want solutions; they want chaos. Moderates build. Extremists tear down."

So let’s be the builders. Let’s reward authenticity. Let’s teach our children by example. And let’s never forget that unity is not weakness. It’s how we win.

Last thought—

I used an artificial intelligence tool to conduct comment sentiment analysis on 370 of the 10,000 plus comments on the Joe Rogan Youtube page from the interview to be 95% accurate of the full comments list. Here is what I found: The newest comments on this Joe Rogan episode overwhelmingly applaud the interview for its depth and civility, with listeners lauding Talarico’s sincerity and compassionate approach to politics. Many viewers said the conversation restored their faith in political discourse, with some non‑religious listeners noting that Talarico’s values resonated with them. Calls for him to seek higher office and requests for more interviews like this were common, while critical comments were rare. You go, Jimmy.

Take care. Let me know what you're seeing out there.

Joseph

Joseph Kopser

Co-Founder of USTomorrow

I encourage you to click here for more on USTomorrow Blogs, Linkedin , X-Twitter, Instagram, Bluesky, Medium, and Facebook.